#222: Scott McGohan: The Hard Truth
Scott is a husband, father, and CEO. He also is really open about all of his failures, and he wants you to learn from them!
https://www.spiritandtruth.life/give
EP. 222
Maybe somebody who, you know is in the business world and needs
Tony: a little thought on how to live out their faith. Guys, I'm thankful for you. And now without any further ado, here's my conversation with Scott Mcgon.
With Jesus. Today's episode is a good one. I got to record in person live with the legendary Scott McGowen. Scott is a believer. He is a C e O, he's an entrepreneur. He's got a book coming out. He's in the waning years of his business career, and he's excited about what God is gonna do next. In our conversation, we talk about.
What it means to be a Christian ceo. We talk about what it means to follow Jesus in the midst of our brokenness, and he is very honest about who he is and what God has called him to. I think [00:01:00] you're really gonna enjoy this conversation. If you do, do me a favor. Hit that subscribe button wherever you listen to podcasts.
Leave a rating of review on iTunes or Spotify, and the highest compliment you can give us. Share this episode with a friend. Maybe somebody who, you know is in the business world and needs a little thought on how to live out their faith. Guys, I'm thankful for you. And now without any further ado, here's my conversation with Scott Mcgon.
Hey everybody. Welcome back to the podcast. I'm excited today to have a podcaster. Eventually, I'm saying it in Jesus' name, . C E o. Father and Friend, Scott McGowen. Scott, thank you so much for being here on the podcast today.
Scott: Hey, Just grateful. So I am, I am looking forward to it.
Tony: Well, you've got such an interesting story from your career, your corporate career.
You've got a beautiful family, but I kind of like to start in the macro, so I'm curious. Yes. How would you [00:02:00] describe the calling that God has placed on your life?
Scott: Great question. You know, for a long time I, I didn't know who he was. Hmm. And I thought he was more of a cop or a principal that was giving me a speeding ticket.
And I, I thought I had to it like maybe. good before I could come to him or he would have anything to do with me. Yeah. And then I learned that he loved me as much as he does today, even at my worst. And that took a long time to figure out. And then as far as a calling today, you know, I've got a past that there's a lot of things I'm not very proud of, but I don't use my past to torture myself, but be useful for others, and I'm not afraid of my past.
And I feel like he's given me a voice to be really authentic and vulnerable. And fearless [00:03:00] and talking about some really complicated, big things. If that makes, if that makes sense.
Tony: Yeah, I think it makes a lot of sense. I also think that there's probably somebody listening right now who feels like God can't love them at their worst.
I love that line. So let me ask you and I, it's an unfair question, how. , how do we get to a place to believe that God can love us at our worst?
Scott: Yeah. I, I, I found mine. You know, in the Bible it says to love th our neighbor as thyself. And the problem with that is if you don't love yourself, then your neighbor or humanity doesn't have a shot.
Hmm. And then when my butt kind of fell off, I walked into recovery rooms and I found. The lonely, tired, broken, and afraid, and through their experience, strength, and hope, they, they loved me when I hated myself [00:04:00] and they taught me how to love myself. And then understanding the love that I had for them opened my eyes and heart to the love that I have for Christ today.
And. . You know, I think surrendering, giving up is at least the only time in my life where I quit and I won. Hmm. And I won big time. But it's a journey. I mean, it really is, it's a journey. Unfortunately. Pain's a great motivator, right? , but I don't wish it all people, but for me, pain was, was a motivator.
So I don't know if that clearly answers your question, but today, I know even in my darkest dark, I was one of those guys where I was like, Hey, God, if you're real, I'm gonna open this Bible and you're gonna, you're gonna show me a page, right? Or turn the light on, like, prove it to me. . Hmm. What I'm, what an immature jerk I [00:05:00] was.
But I would test him all the time. And none of that stuff happened. And then I thought, well, you're not real. Hmm. And but where he was real is he was real and other. People, like I saw him through other and listened to him through other people. Wow. Which was really, really powerful for me.
Tony: So what's interesting about your story?
Knowing it a little bit, doing a little bit of a research in the world's eyes, you would've already been fairly successful by the time that you walked into your first recovery room. And so, It would be not too much of a stretch to say, a, a guy who had most everything that people want, walked into a room of people who are on the margins or have nothing and learned everything.
Can you kind of take us through that story, like, yeah. How does a guy who's built a, a very successful business, you know, representing, you know, 1500 employer. [00:06:00] Belly buttons, as you like to say, all over, all over the world. , how, how does a guy like that end up in a recovery room?
Scott: Yeah, I mean, I think for great question.
For me, I had this really warped sense of self-worth. I thought self-worth equaled performance plus the opinions of others. Hmm. So your opinion of me meant a lot more than my own opinion of myself. And I'll go back when. I'd wear a patch on my eye in the third grade, so I got a ton of pirate jokes in elementary school.
I'm dyslexic, so reading in front of a class was really complicated. When I was younger, I used to love to write poetry. I used to like to draw, but society told me that little boys weren't supposed to do that. Hmm. When I was probably a sophomore in high school we were going to a Reds game in the backseat of a car, and it's the first time I ever I ever drank.
And then on the way down there I was funny. And instead of people laughing at [00:07:00] me, they were laughing with me. Wow. And my personality changed, but I got a affirmation through crew jokes, through sarcasm. through, and I thought that was really affirming. So I, I, I changed the complexion of who I thought I was to please you, and in the middle of all that, and then unfortunately I got into sales, right?
Which sales is like, like a chameleon. , I gotta act one way in a bar, one way in a golf course, one way, you know, engineering firm one way at a marketing firm. And then I became really successful which was also equally dangerous. . And then that success led to, you know, homes a lake house, boats, cars, all of this stuff I never thought I'd have before.
And I remember one day I walked into my house and I looked at a full length mirror. And I hated the guy looking back. I hated [00:08:00] everything about him. I couldn't stand him. I couldn't, I could not look myself in the mirror.
Tony: Paint. Paint your family picture for us at that time, because this isn't like , you, you had, you were fairly well established.
I was 42 years old. Yeah. I mean, you're the same age as I am now. Yeah. How many kids do you have at this point in time? Two.
Scott: Two. You know, both of 'em in high school. Okay. Mary, and really, you know, from the outside, I mean, as far as I, you know, and I, and I was going to church, I was leading a men's ministry at Southbrook.
Right. I mean, I'm like, I've got like things going on. But it didn't solve, Big, dark, gaping hole in my soul. And it was starving for something. And unfortunately I wanted to die. Hmm. And then I, I had a lot of successful people that I worked with. And a lot of people that wore suits every day.
But my brother was in recovery and when I saw him hang around his friends, and this is really immature, but it's honest. All the [00:09:00] people that he hung out with didn't have what I had. and didn't drive what I had, didn't live in the same neighborhood. And when my butt fell off, I didn't go to Suits.
I went to them cuz they were the most authentic people I'd ever met in my life. I mean, and, and I That sounds super arrogant and I don't mean to sound arrogant, but it was super honest and it was, it was those guys in their honesty and authentic. that didn't judge me, you know allowed me to walk in, recover rooms and say, my name's Scott and my soul's broken.
And that's all I said for a year. And they, they carried me, they carried me through it.
Tony: It's interesting to me that you said you did that for a. , I, I know a lot of people who are in similar spaces that you were, where they feel like their butt's [00:10:00] falling off or they, they've got that big gaping hole and they want a pill or they want one meeting with a counselor, or they'd like to go to one, you know, 12 step meeting and hear something miraculous and just be healed.
Can you talk about that ear? That feels like a grind to me. Oh, yeah. As someone. Who's been in recovery rooms too and has kept the counselor for 10 years because I just know who I am. How, how does that all work? How did that work in the season of that year?
Scott: Yeah, I mean, I tried everything. So I read a lot of books, a lot of self-help books.
I, I was on antidepressants and then antidepressants for some will cut really well. But for me, what happened is reality never showed up in my life. Hmm. So when I got depressed or upset or angry or mad, wouldn't have, there was either alcohol numbed it or a prescription drug all of a sudden didn't make things so bad.
Hmm. Well, when all of that went away, I was faced with, [00:11:00] wow, this is like, this is ugly. And. And my wife had seen me for years, get involved in all kinds of things and whatever I touched it was, was just like 10,000 RPMs. Yeah. All or nothing. Yeah. Just boom, we're going and look out. Get outta my way. And I, and I knew if I told her, that I was going to recovery room, that she would think, here's one more thing.
Hmm. So I actually lied to her. I actually told her I was going to a Bible study. Yeah. And and I'm not sure I really shared back then, like how dark it was for me. Yeah. That I wanted, and I'm not sure why I did or it didn't. , but I knew, I, I, I'd seen psychiatrists before, but I lied to him. I lied to a psychiatrist.
I lied to myself. I lied to my, I lied to my wife. I lied to everybody. Lying was easier for me than telling the truth. . Wow. And then when [00:12:00] I got into recovery and I heard the stories of these incredible authentic men the truth was amazing. One, it gave me a reference point, and this is not fair, but it's honest is in some cases be like, well, I'm not that bad.
Right? I'm not that bad. Mm-hmm. . But it also gave evidence to the fact that, man, I wasn't alone. There were a lot of guys in that room that were. , you know, really struggling with self-worth, really struggling with, you know, whether it be bankruptcy here, divorce or death, or all these crazy things. And, and I was allowed to talk about it and no one was gonna judge me.
And then, Over that year. I, you know, they, they say keep coming back. It works cuz you're worth it. Actually, they say it works if you work it. And I had a friend of mine, his name was Brian, he's, he's dead. He died of an overdose. Wow. But he used to tell me all the time Scott, it works cuz you're worth it.
and I, I needed someone to tell me that, that I was [00:13:00] worth it. Cause I didn't think I was, I thought it was worthless. Now, from a public persona, it looked like I had everything, but I had nothing. Cause if you don't have love yourself, you got nothing. And so I just kept coming back. I stared at the table for, you know, every Monday night at seven o'clock.
And. The funny thing happened along the way is I, I would talk in a meeting and I would tell something about something amazing that happened, and then I would get affirmed by that, and it was the first time that someone would compliment me. For telling the truth, I could always lie. Yeah. Or embellish or tell stories and I would be affirmed, but I never really got affirmed for telling the truth, if that makes sense.
And then all of a sudden, like telling the truth was I was like pretty freeing. Like I could go to, I could go into a room and actually tell the truth. And yeah, it was a long. , [00:14:00] I mean, every Monday night, and I've done it every Monday night for 14 years. Wow. So you still go to meetings now? Every I wouldn't miss 'em for the world.
The cool thing is, is back then, like I needed to go. Right. It was a matter of life and death for me. And today I, I want to go like I want to. For a lot of reasons. One is I need to, I get to walk in when I see a new person walk in that room and I get to say, thereby the grace of God, they're a go. Aye, yeah.
Or I get to go into that room and learn something new about humanity. Those are rooms. It's just humanity and it's, I almost think of it as like, like we were talking about the chosen Yeah. Jesus and the apostles and it's like, I feel like I'm in a room with like, like men that are just not afraid to pair their souls.
That was a long answer to a really short question.
Tony: The best part about podcasts is that they're long forming for. Long form. So we're here for the long answers and the, and the stories are important and I actually think it brings [00:15:00] us to a really interesting intersection. So you were a believer before you stepped into the room.
And, and I would say through previous conversations, one of the things I learned about you is that you were active, but you weren't following necessarily. How, how would you describe the change that you saw in your relationship with God over that? and 14 years since.
Scott: Yeah. Great question. You know, I, I go to, I go to Southbrook.
I love it.
Tony: Pastor Charlie's been on the podcast twice. Yeah.
Scott: Great guy. A great friend of mine too. But I always felt like I had to go to church to learn about God. Hmm. So I had to, like, I had to pull in a parking spot and walk into brick and mortar, and then I would read the Bible, but I wouldn't underst.
But I would learn a lot more if I just listened to Charlie and there was a period in my life where like, yeah, that's just being lazy. Hmm. That's just lazy because I'm not, he doesn't want a relationship with Scott McGowan through [00:16:00] Charlie McMahan. Right. He wants a relationship with Scott McGowan. That's what he wants.
Come on. And so today, y you know obviously still go to Southbrook. Love it. Recovery meetings at Southbrook. But today my relationship is is without brick and mortar. It's my relationship with him. When I get up in the morning, I pray in the morning, or when I'm in a, a meeting during the. Or events that happen.
I'm constantly asking him questions every single day. I am shocked every morning I wake up because I'm not this virtuous and I'm not this noble. I know it is. I am so grateful that he is normally the number one thing that comes in my mind when my eyes open up. Wow. , and I'm not, I'm not that good of a person, but he makes me, does that make sense?
Yeah. He makes me that good. And when that feeling, that's the Holy Spirit's speaking to me. Yeah. It's like, Hey Scott, what? What we have planned today is the first thing is [00:17:00] admiration towards Christ. And when that comes into my life in the morning. , my day is normally gonna go pretty well. When it doesn't, I don't know, maybe not so well
Tony: But one of the things that I say on here a lot is that if you're not dedicated to your disciplines, you'll be destroyed by your distractions. Mm-hmm. . And I heard you say on Jay Meyers podcast talking about how important your daily habits. Prayer, exercise, planning, you know, kind of starting your day on your knees, that perspective.
H how did you kind of form this daily routine? And when did you know that it, it made a difference at how you started your day, made a difference in how you ended your day? . Yeah. Oh,
Scott: the first part of it was, was really exercise. And that was, that was all vanity. So I used to weigh 50 more pounds than I weighed a day, and I could only put on two pair of pants.
Hmm. And so the first part was, was exercise. But looking [00:18:00] back, that was, 100% vanity, which sometimes is not bad. Yeah. I, listen, I, there's, so I lost 50 pounds and then I, when I entered recovery, I had, my brother told me, he goes, I want you to get up in the morning and pray this prayer. God, remove everything I know about me, you, and
Tony: this world.
Okay. You gotta say that one more time, just a little bit slower cuz I think, okay. Somebody needs to hear this right now. Yeah.
Scott: He said, God, pray this. God, please remove everything I know about me, you and this world. Hmm. And today opened my heart to a new experience about me, you, and this world. Wow. And I asked him, what does that mean?
He said, , it doesn't matter what it means, . I just want you to pray it , because I wanted someone to explain it to me. Yeah. Does that make sense? But today, oh my gosh, do I understand that? Because in my arrogance, I wanted all the answers. Yeah. And and I love that prayer today. And a, a new experience and come, come, come forward [00:19:00] about this world, about him or about myself.
Tony: Today, 14 years into this, you're very open about your shortcomings. Yep. You lead with them. I think in the first five minutes that you and I first met at Dorothy Lane you talked to me about your ego. You talk, you've talked about your arrogance. Right. Yet your work at Mago and Brave Bender is still just continuing to grow and God continues to bless it.
Talk to me about what it's like to be a Christian ceo O who is the who's leading with all of his shortcomings and how that represents yours, represents itself in the workplace and with your
Scott: customers. Yeah, good question. You know, I think for, for me, I had someone tell me one, one time, he said, you're, you're, you're vulnerable.
It makes you look weak. Hmm. And then I said, that might be the weakest thing I've ever heard.[00:20:00] Cuz I spent my entire world making sure that you thought I was a big deal and it almost killed me. Wow. So recognizing that in order for me to really grow, my ego had to die. And it. now, huh? I still have an ego , and I still have pride and I still like it.
It lives in me every single day. Sure. But, but today it's in check. Hmm. Like even, even the 12 steps, like I, I know, I know when I offend somebody or I say something like I have, I have the ability to correct that. . But if I carry that into the next day, then that's just gonna be a backpack that I'm carrying on my, you know, on my on my back.
And then that causes resentment and resentment or expectations will be the downfall of me. Now for as far as at a ceo. , he, here's what I know. I know every man, woman, and a child that walk in this building are [00:21:00] dealing with addiction. They're dealing with death. They're dealing with divorce. They're dealing with abuse.
They're dealing with financial fear. They're dealing with afraid to go their mailbox. They're afraid of how am I gonna, kids, my send my kids to school? They're afraid of, is my car gonna break down? Is my credit card gonna work inside the walls of Mago, Andre Bender? That happens every day. Someone touches that, that door and they walk in this building and for some employers, they feel like you should leave that stuff at home.
Well, that stuff doesn't stay at home. If I can be vulnerable enough and share my own experience, then maybe that man or woman says, well, holy cow. Then I'm allowed to come into work with these problems and I can be vulnerable and I can be open. And I think it just lets people know that they're not alone.
Hmm. And I don't know. Hey guys,
Tony: just pausing this conversation with Scott to remind you that this podcast is part of the Spirit and Truth [00:22:00] Ministry team. What does that mean? It means that as you're thinking about your end of the year gift, I would be incredibly humbled and honored if you'd consider supporting this podcast by giving to Spirit and truth.
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I'm incredibly thankful for the opportunity to serve you in this capacity. Now, let's finish up. this conversation with Scott Mcgon. I, I think that's great. I mean, sometimes relatability is the best gift we can give to the people who are around us. I, I'm also curious cuz you're [00:23:00] very open about your faith which as a, as a pastor and a ministry leader, I appreciate how much tension do you feel as a ceo?
I mean, CEO. In the community, the Miami Valley Mcgon, brave Bender is a major player in in helping the community and, and just being involved in the city of Dayton in general and And you're also very open about being a Christian. If, if you had to give some words of wisdom to people who are listening right now, who are showing up to work, and maybe they're middle management, maybe they're a leader somewhere, but they're not sure how to represent their faith in the workplace, how do we do that with grace and love and respect?
Scott: Yeah, that's a good que You know, I, I've always said, . I mean, I, I, for me specifically, is my faith's really important to me. I have five core values, and I'll share this with anyone on the, on the planet. Hmm. My faith is my foundation. I will not waiver. Number two is my wife is [00:24:00] my best friend and will never.
Part number three is all people, all people minus serious mental health illness are decent and needed, reminded that they're loved. . Number four is I'm my own worst enemy and I know it. And number five is I'll do everything in my power to protect the culture of mago and braven. That's how they are today.
But when I think about, I, I think in regards to faith is if you have to use words, do so. Hmm. But your faith should be more representation of your actions than your. . So in regards to your ability to be empathetic towards people, your ability to be unbelievably self-aware in a room, body language, understand what people are dealing with.
And then the other thing too is like being really self-aware. I always tell people, look, I'm on the membership committee, not the recruitment committee. I'm the recruitment committee, not the membership committee. , let me back that up. [00:25:00] Is the fact that no faith is faith in something. Hmm. No faith is faith in something.
And so whether you know you are Jewish or Muslim, like all of that all that's available. For, to have a loving conversation with other people. Hmm. But the second I take my faith and I shove it or push it towards someone that quite frankly, that's what pushed me away from faith to begin with.
Wow. And there, there's beautiful examples inside of, I I think for me when my heart starts to be, and I can feel today, I'm not ashamed to say it's a Holy Spirit speaking to. Yeah, when I get in a situation, my heart starts to beat. That's telling me I need to do something. And that normally means take action.
And then when I, sometimes when I take that action, including inside of the walls of Mago and bra bender and praying, [00:26:00] and some people will say, well, you're not allowed to do that. I'm like, huh, I think I can . And if you don't like it, like just like the national anthem, you can take. Right. But I'm gonna pray.
But most people, the majority people will come up afterwards and say, thank you. Thank you. Because society is so afraid of it that we're actually moving away from God now coming towards him. Hmm. And I think as leaders sometimes, as long as we're not boisterous and arrogant and pointing the finger, but if we're, if we're in love, society wants more.
again, a really long answer to a short question. .
Tony: That's perfect. I would be remiss if I did not go back and revisit your values. Yep. Because I know that there are a lot of families who are striving to find something to build on. And the way that you rattled off those five, right. Your faith wife, all people are decent.
Need to be loved. I'm my own worst enemy. [00:27:00] Protect the culture. But go and bread Brenner no matter what the cost. How, how did you talk to me about that process? Because I think there's a lot of people who are looking for a battle cry in their life, and you just rattled yours off like it was. I mean, guys, there's no notes here.
Like this was all, you know, he's not, he didn't pull out his phone and read it. This was straight from his heart, I think. . People want that. How did you get there?
Scott: Yeah, I had a, well, I had a coach that actually it's a longer story, but about 20 years ago, my assistant Victoria came in my office and said, you have values painted on the wall.
I was in sales back then and really successful, and then sales, you have values painted on the wall. I have my own set of values. And you torque them every day. Today's my last day, . Yeah. I just saw her today. We, she came to the retiree launch. Oh, . So I went home that night. I was more concerned about what people would think about me.
Yeah. With her leaving. then physically [00:28:00] hurt leaving mm-hmm. . And so I went back to her the next day and said, Hey, if I hired a coach, cuz I, I know how to sell, but I don't know how to care and nurture and love people, and I gave you access to that coach, would you gimme a chance? And she said, yeah. And then we made an agreement that we would ask each other three questions every day.
Am I okay? , are you okay? Are we okay? And so I got really involved in emotional intelligence, really involved in reading, got a coach, and that coach sat me one down one day and said, if we had to, if we had to describe your purpose, what would it be? And sadly the very first attempt of that was around what year I was gonna.
How much money I had in the bank, the stuff that I would have, none of it was about me or my family. That's horrible for me to say, but it was, that was a reality for Scott back then. And then after a while I started considering, Hey, [00:29:00] what's gonna move and carry me forward? What's gonna move me forward? So the first thing was the fact that my faith had carried me that far.
Yeah. So let's just call that number one. It, it is my foundation. I will not waver publicly. I will not. And and then my wife, my wife had put up with a lot of stuff for me. All my shenanigans. She's tolerated a bond. She's a big place in heaven for her. And then understanding that the lonely, broken, tired, and afraid that was me.
Yeah. And then I honestly believe that most people are decent and good, even people that do horrific things, bad, bad stuff, bad stuff. And most just need to be reminded that they're loved. And then the one is around, you know, I am my own worst enemy. I think a lot of people need to understand they are their own worst.
and your brain's like a bad neighborhood, and you should not be there alone. Amen. Christ can come into that brain. Recovery rooms can come in that brain, friends can come into that brain, get that poison outta your head, [00:30:00] outta your mouth, and someone else's eyes and ears, and it'll dampen that that pain.
And then the fourth one, the fifth one, is really about this company. And, but you know, I'm 18 months away from retirement, so the fifth one's gonna change. So I have no idea what. When I leave here Yeah. It's gonna change.
Tony: Yeah. I, you know, so I, let's talk about retirement a little bit. Yeah. If we can. I have a dear friend of mine, Tony Hickson, who was on the podcast, and one of the things he said is that we don't retire from something very well, but we retire to something and.
And I think that you're the kind of guy that is retiring to something. Talk to me about your visions for what you're retiring to.
Scott: You know, I wrote a book that'll come out in the spring. We're gonna have you
Tony: back on the podcast to talk about the book.
Scott: So I'm real excited about that. But, but honestly, I, what's the book about?
You gotta tell everyone, tease it. It's it's called Culture is an Inside Job. Hmm. So it's really around organizational culture and what do you believe in? Hmm. So if you're a, you know, a company that wants to grow and sell, [00:31:00] and you wanna retire, then that's great. But don't tell your employees that you love them and you want to keep this place here forever, right?
Whatever is authentic is what your culture should be. And even if it sounds bad, it could sound good to other people. Just don't lie to people. Just have the, your culture be authentic from the inside. What does. Yeah, like I had a guy, he says, you know, I like I'm want a great culture. I'm like, if I had to walk out and ask your workforce, are you a bad guy, a good guy, or a great guy?
He said, what would they say? He said, I'd probably say I'm a good guy. I'm like, okay, I'm great. Why don't you just tell your people that you wanna be a good company? Great. Not available. You're not great. You're good. You're barely good. Does that, does that make sense? Yeah. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. The coldest spade of spade.
Right. And so I'm real excited about that. But going back to what retirement I've spent my whole life looking forward and being in charge and have, be responsibility of vision and, [00:32:00] and that away on somebody. Hmm. And then as I'm winding down, what's really kind of cool is I, I don't, I don't have to do that right now, so I'm spending a lot of time in reflection.
I've asked my wife is you, you've walked with me for two thirds of our life. What's your last third goal? You wanna restore houses? You want to, like, what do you want to do? Because I'll follow you in that like you've followed me. Yeah. But. If you don't have anything ,
Tony: I got some ideas. Yeah.
Scott: That, yeah. And me doing nothing is just bad for humanity.
It's just not gonna end. It's not gonna, no, it's gonna be bad. .
Tony: Yeah. One of my favorite scriptures is John 15. It's where Jesus washes the disciples feet. And and as I heard you talk, what I saw was John 15 and I thought, oh, Scott is entering his foot washing season. His foot washing season, he's gonna go in and knowing who he [00:33:00] is and where he's from, he's gonna become vulnerable, take off his outer tunic as Jesus says, and wash his disciples feet.
Yeah. So that's an exciting, that's an exciting season. I am curious about the book writing process and, and we're gonna have you come back on to talk about the book, but you're a guy who moves really fast and. From one thing to the next, I can just tell you operate with a certain level of intensity, which I deeply appreciate.
I'm an intense guy myself. What was it like to sit down and write the book out like that? Pr I mean, to, to focus the thoughts for that much time and to try to put that in. I would imagine that that had some emotional repercussions. Oh,
Scott: yeah. But, but you know, I think, you know, with the right people that can kind of coach you around it.
Sure. So, you know, what does a chapter look like? And a chapter looks like maybe 30 pages be like, okay, so if I had to write, if I had to write one page a day, oh, that, I could probably, and I enjoy [00:34:00] writing. I feel, and I learned that in recovery when you journal, like amazing things can, can can happen.
And then it was, you know, it was probably, it probably took two years to do it. Wow. And then Covid happened. and then that, you know, took a big, huge, gigantic backseat. And then the good thing, like I've got a lot of good stories in there about things that I've learned. You know, and I, I don't mean this come out the wrong way, but I, I, I, I've had some people that have taught about culture but maybe sometimes they haven't let a company Hmm.
But academically they understand it. Sure. And, but if you haven't had to deal. And aren't passionate about it. Then it, it, it just gets wonky for people. And so the reason for the book would be I want, I want it for two reasons. One is I wanted a company to be able to read it and say, Hey, I want an authentic culture.
So I want to help discover what that might look like. It doesn't have to be about ping pong [00:35:00] balls, you know, ping pong tables and ball chair. . But the other thing I wanted to do is I wanted a young single mom to read it and be able to walk into a CEO's office and say, Hey, look, I think we can change some things around here.
Hmm. Because it's not a CEO that can manage the culture. It could be. It should be. But a lot of times it's, it's someone really young that says, Hey, I'm gonna change things around here. I'm either gonna get fired, , I'm gonna be a leader. And I love that when they just torque it. Right. Like move it forward. So yeah, it was cool.
So I had a lot of fun doing it. That's good. I, I'm excited
Tony: to get a copy of my hands. So one thing I know about my community is that they love to pray. Yep. And so when I bring somebody on like you, who is in a season of transition and a season of movement, and God is just clearly stirring you up it wouldn't surprise me if next time we meet it's Pastor Scott.
It wouldn't surprise me at all. Right? Like how, how can my podcast family pray for you? . [00:36:00]
Scott: I would probably say, you know, I've done, I think I've done a, and this is hard to say, but it's honest. I've done a better job leading this company than maybe I have done leading my own family. Hmm. And that's hard, but it's honest and I've.
Maybe an ability in this last third to be a better husband, a better grandfather, and a better dad, is all the things that my family got to watch me do here and do publicly that maybe they might see that same leader lead their family in a different way, if that makes sense. Yeah.
Tony: All right. We'll pray for that.
Yeah, I love that. That's a. .
Scott: So, but I really, you know, as we kind of wrap up here, there's a, there's a psalm that I've, I've fallen in love with and Psalm 34 mm-hmm. , and I found [00:37:00] it, and I love it because, you know, David lived a life of just some shenanigans, , right? Yeah, for sure. And I talk to a lot of people, it'll be like, Hey, is what you did in the dictionary?
I'm like, what do you mean? I'm like, well, you know, thinking that you're really shameful and guilty is, is the word in the D. And I'm like, well, yeah. I'm like, okay, that means somebody else did it before. Yep. So you're, in other words, you're not alone. But in Psalm 34, I believe I have this right, but what it says is those who look upon him are radiant and their faces are never covered in shame, lower in shame.
And I think for some of us, our faces are lowered in shame. and he can heal you of all of that. And so if we're called to be disciples, then what we're called to be is we're called to be radiant. And a way to be radiant [00:38:00] is to accept the grace of that shame. Yeah. And shine. And I, I just love that. It's just, it comes alive in my heart.
So
Tony: that's good. That's real good. Okay. I have one more question for you. Yeah. But before I ask it, I know. My audience is gonna want to know how to follow you and what God is doing in you and through you. Where's the best place to learn all things? Scott McGaw.
Scott: Oh my gosh, I don't know. I'm mean LinkedIn.
Tony: LinkedIn, okay. We'll, we'll link to that in the show notes. Yeah. And we'll put it out there if if that's where they'll learn about how to pre-order the book. Yeah, absolutely. So they can just connect with you on LinkedIn and you, you're very active on there, so it's a great place to learn, learn what God's doing inside you.
Okay. Last question. I always ask people, it's an advice question and I asked your partner it already when you, if you were to go back in time and give yourself one piece of advice, I'm gonna take you back to a very specific day. The day before [00:39:00] you saw yourself in that full length mirror. Mm-hmm. . If you could sit and need a knee with that wayward, lost young man, hold his hands.
Look him in the eyes and tell him one thing. Yeah. What's the one thing?
Scott: The one thing, it's kind of harsh, but it's the truth. I think I would tell 'em, the people that you're trying to please don't care about you as much as you think they do. and the people that care about you the most, you're not trying to please at all.
So I was trying to please everyone else around me except for myself and and my family. So probably be, get over it, tiger. and you're gonna be okay. , I think.
Tony: I love it. That'll preach.
Scott: Yeah. , [00:40:00] that'll preach.
Tony: I think that'll preach Also, I, my new favorite Scott quote is, it's not, I, you know, it's not fair, but it's honest
Oh yeah. It's not easy, but it's honest. Yeah. I, I love that. I love that so much. Scott, thank you so much for your generosity today. Oh, okay. Yeah. For your vulnerability and I'm really excited to stay connected as we both continue on in this journey. Yeah. Well, I appreciate. What a great conversation with Scott.
I love his heart. I love the way he takes an honest kind of approach to just how he does life and it's so good. I think Scott's one of those guys that you just naturally wanna follow. You can connect with him on LinkedIn, stay connected to him through various ways, and just let him know that you heard him here on the podcast.
It's a great like I said, it's just he's such a great guy. He's got so much wisdom to offer us and I can assure you, he'll be back on very. To talk about his new book, what that means and what it all looks like. I'm really thankful for our growing friendship. Guys. Merry Christmas. It's the end [00:41:00] of 2022.
It's hard to believe it. I'll be taken next week off to spend a little time with the family. So thank you guys so much for the opportunity to serve you in 2022. I can't wait to see what God does next. Remember guys, if you want to follow Jesus, you must be willing to move.
