#132: Andi Andrew: Friendship - It's Complicated
Andi is a pastor, speaker, and author who is passionate about helping you connect to others in an authentic way. In my conversation with Andi we explore what it means to be vulnerable, have good boundaries, and what type of friendship is the best kind of friendship.
She has a pastoral voice on a difficult topic that we all need to hear.
Links:
EP. 132
Tony: [00:00:00] Hey everybody. Welcome back to the Reclamation Podcast, where our goal is to help you reclaim good practices for faith and life. My name is Tony and today is episode 1 30, 2 of the podcasts where I sit down with author speaker and pastor Andy Andrews. Andy has a brand new resource out called Franklin.
It's complicated. And I can't tell you how excited I was to jump into this topic, because I know so many adults, men and women who struggle with friendship. And what does that mean? And what's it look like? And what's it look like in the lens of our faith? I know you're going to love this conversation with her, and if you do love the conversation, do me a favor, hit that subscribe button, wherever you listen to podcasts.
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I'm thankful to be on this mission with you and without any further ado, here's my conversation. With Andy Andrews. Welcome back to the podcast. I'm excited today to have a pastor author and speaker, pastor Andy, Andrew from New York city, pastor. Thank you so much for being here today.
Andi: Thank you for having me.
I'm glad to be with you.
Tony: So I don't normally start with a history question first, but I am curious, how does a [00:02:00] girl from Spokane Washington go to Sydney, Australia, meet her husband, and then end up in New York.
Andi: That is a wild ride. Is it not? Yeah, I was actually just back in Spokane and I was like, I grew up here, like it had been 18 years and I couldn't, you know what I mean?
It's been so long since I've been there. It was like wild. I can't believe this used to be my life, but yeah, I mean, met and married. My husband in Sydney went there. For Bible college and married him a year later and then had three kids under the age of three, like in quick succession. And after that, yeah, it was, it was very fast.
But then after actually after I had my first child Zeke, are you. Or sorry, our eldest I actually had a dream that we were in New York city and I could see the back of three children. And literally this was when we only had one child and we were on the subway on the way home on the way home from a church we'd planted.
So I woke up the next morning and. I actually feel like we might plant a church in New York one day and he's like, that's weird. [00:03:00] I said, I know. So if it's got, I guess we'll find out. Or I had too much pizza last night. It was one of the two, so long story short, fast forward three kids under the age of three and God starts to bring up New York city.
And it is obviously a lot longer story than that, but there was, we went and we, we came here and we were like, God, is this where you want us? And there's a beautiful story about. I spoke to us, went back, talked to our pastors and Sidney asked for their blessing and permission to go. They sent us and we started with literally our family.
That was it. There was no one. And we're like, we are wild. Like this is, we took our life savings. We sold everything. We invested it into New York city. And 11 years later, we're still here hobbling a little bit, but we're still here.
And one more kid, we had an American born child. Yeah.
Tony: I love it. I love it. And I always love to ask people, how do you discern [00:04:00] what really is God's voice and on big steps like that in your life? Like, how do you know that it was God that called you there? And again, not, not the pizza per se.
Andi: I actually love that question because I think it's really important.
I think for us, there was multiple factors in it. So obviously you. I have a dream like that. Or even if someone, it, it tells us in the word of God to test a prophetic word that you don't cause it could be wrong and it could have been too much pizza. And so we do have to test those things. So there was like multiple tests that went with that.
Obviously what's illuminated in the word of God. What is speaking to us? What do we see when it comes to planting churches? What's the model for that? Is it, do we stay in one place for our whole lives or, and you know, all of those sorts of things. So we looked at all of those things. We definitely want.
And came to New York city and tested out to see if this, if God spoke to us here, I was really hoping he would say, no, no, I'm just kidding. At that time. I was, and now I love living here, so I'm great. But I was freaked out. I was like, how do we do this? And. [00:05:00] I spoke to both of us. I mean, for me, it was outside of St.
Paul's chapel where they, they took care of all of the volunteers for nine 11, and there was this whole thing that God's God, like, just whispered to me, he said, these people are now your people. And I just knew I was, we were being written into the soil of New York city and my husband just really heard from God to then the other test.
I mean, we had multiple fleeces, if you will. And then we went and we spoke to our senior pastor and I went, he could say no way, you guys are crazy. And we both kind of went in going, if he says, you guys are wrong, like this is not God. And I know not everybody agrees with this, but we kind of knew if he releases us it's really God does that make sense?
And so we put that fleece out if you will. And he goes, well, there's the door, you have my blessing. You can go. We're like, wait, And so then we freaked out, but there was this one moment I would love to tell you this one story, because this is really helpful too. Before we met with our senior [00:06:00] pastor, both Paul and I were praying reading the word of God.
So for me, I went to the book of acts because I was like, how do you even plan a church? Like, I need to know, I need to go and see the birth of the church and how it began and what the people did. And as I'm writing. I, I felt as I was praying as I was journaling the Lord say your church will be called Liberty because you'll bring freedom to the captives.
And then the holy spirit said, but don't tell your husband. I said, okay. Three days later, my husband says, I think I know the name of our church. And I'm like, oh. And so he, he literally takes a moment and he goes, I honestly, I, he goes, it could be dumb. I don't know. Maybe it's a bad name. I was like, just tell me what it is.
He goes, I think it's called Liberty church. I was like, I'm going to throw up now. So I, yeah, I went and got my journal and I opened it up and showed him. And he was like, oh, I think we both just knew there was too many things. That we're pointing to this, this direction that if we ignored it, it would have been [00:07:00] disobedient.
Or we would have wondered for the rest of our lives. Like what if? And so we even said to our senior pastor, if we go and utterly fail, we'll just come back. We'll like humbly come back to Australia and we just, that's kind of how we navigated it. So.
Tony: So I'm curious, what have you learned about yourself and the process of planning a church that's now have has a global impact. You have communities all over the world and London and various places. W what have you learned? The local church, the global church. And you're yourself in the process.
That's a, that's a really big, unfair question.
Andi: Okay. What have I learned? Well, I have learned many things. Gosh, I have learned I'm trying to, because you did, you asked a big question. I like saw multiple facets. Can you edit this?
Tony: Yeah.
Andi: I'm so sorry that I'm like I'm taking a minute. Cause I think that's a really valuable question.
Tony: Okay. Well please [00:08:00] do. It was, as soon as it came out of my mouth, I was like, well, Tony that's that's far too big for any one person to answer on the spot, right?
Andi: No, it actually took me once. That's a good question. So I'll, I'll pause for a second. So you can edit with a clean cut first. I think one of the biggest things that I have learned about myself is that I, I need that.
To sorry, let me start that over. One of the biggest things I learned about myself in leading when we planted here is how much, I didn't know who I was. And that was a little bit of a scary a scary place to be in. And I think planting a church brought me to my knees in the best way. And And either what was going to happen is I was going to break down or I was going to become whole, and I was going to run to Jesus and just get stronger and stronger.
And so I think for me and my husband, it actually drew us closer together instead of dividing us because we knew that planting a church together in this city. And I would say in the time that we planted it, but I would say the whole last 11 years that we've been here, I have been some of the most [00:09:00] difficult in different ways for the city and for the nation, if you will.
That leading here has literally brought us to our knees. So I think church planting, if we try to do this in our own strength, I think it would have broken us. And we really just needed to focus on our mental, emotional, spiritual, and physical health. And I also think for me, I've got four beautiful children that are now 16.
Gosh, how old are they? 16, 14, 13, and nine. And I think we have realized how important it is to disciple our children. The family unit we're really, truly, it feels like missionaries in the city. Cause we don't have lines out the door coming to church. We have beautiful communities here in the city and outside of the city, the outside of the city.
But really making disciples. The great commission is really our heart and doing that in a slow and steady way. We weren't a church that had like explosive growth or anything like that. We have kind of remained in these beautiful, steady communities where there's been a lot of turnover. And one more thing I'll I'll [00:10:00] add is that I didn't know how high my pain threshold was until I planted a church.
And so. I would say, I was like, wow. And also people really just love to tell you what they think about a lot of things. When you plant a church, I was like, wow, thank you for all your opinions. I was not ready for this. So yeah. Yeah.
Tony: A lot of things. I deeply appreciate. Yeah, no, I appreciate that. I appreciate that.
I'm always curious about people's daily disciplines. One of the things that we say around here a lot is that if you're not dedicated to your disciplines, you'll be destroyed by your distractions.
Andi: And so, oh, thank you.
Tony: I'm curious. What are some of the things that you do on a daily basis that keep you as you said.
Andi: Whole yeah, those things would be, I get up before my children.
So I have to set the alarm and we're back in the, you know, back to school routine. That was nice in the summertime. Cause they, Mike children can sleep for ever. So [00:11:00] like in that season, it really is. They just sleep and sleep. And so I would have like these long extended, like quiet times with the Lord before they'd awaken, but for me now, it looks like more.
I love to wake up, turn on worship music upstairs, grab my cup of coffee, try to set an atmosphere for where my kids walk up and start, you know, making their breakfast and, and get time in the word, whether that is 10 minutes, 30 minutes. And a lot of times I'll focus on at the moment. I've been in the letters to the church from the apostle Paul.
And that actually has been life for me over the last two years pastoring through a pandemic and shut downs and opinions. I've had to read how the apostle Paul maneuvered a lot of. People really come in for him. And so how do you do this in the, in these cities? You know what I mean? That are really difficult that keep people's foundation in Christ.
And so I think for me, that's really where I [00:12:00] start. And then obviously there are mornings where, you know what my kids get up early. They have more needs, it doesn't work as well. And so what I tried to do is whether that's like this morning, I took my dog on a walk and I told my friend. Literally lost her mother.
I said, I'm going to pray over you while I walk. And so just trying to find those rhythms of where do, I mean, God is in every moment, but you know, like acknowledging his presence is really important. And so I think those are the things that have really truly. Kept me grounded is I know it's so simple.
But really, truly reading the word every single day, creating an atmosphere in my house. And then my husband and I actually put it in our schedule to pray together once a week. And we get up early and that we kind of were like, how have we not been doing this? Our whole marriage? We've almost been married 20 years, but only over the last two years where we were literally brought to our knees.
Have we been praying together? And that has been really powerful too.
Tony: Yeah. That's one of the things, whenever I'm doing premarital counseling, I make [00:13:00] all my couples pray over each other. As a, as a daily discipline, before they go to bed a go ahead and just, I need my wife to pray evil out of me every day.
Andi: I think I might start. I'm going to take that marriage advice and tell my husband when he gets home from his trip, this is what we're doing now. You just kidding. That's amazing.
Tony: It, it came out of, it came out of a lot of brokenness. We, we really needed some healing and restoration and it was just a really good practice.
It's just, it's really hard to stay angry at somebody. You have to pray over every night.
Andi: That's so true.
Noted. I'm remembering that.
Tony: So I, I'm also curious, you've got this, this brand new resource out, and it's all about relationships. It's about friendships specifically. And, and I was thinking as I was kind of reading and kind of learning about your writing and your heart how long did it take to put this together and did you know it was going to come out in what could arguably described [00:14:00] as the most disconnected time in humanity?
Andi: I had no idea it was going to come out in the most disconnected, disconnected time in history, and honestly probably make people super uncomfortable to read. But for me, this book in particular, I mean, I'm really passionate about relationships and healthy relationships and they re it really stems from a broken childhood and a broken.
My parents that are now redeemed and restored because of a lot of intentionality. And so that's helped me, obviously in my parenting and in my own marriage. But in gosh, about 2018. So before these last two years of, you know, isolation and self protection. Okay. And self preservation that we're all kind of trying to combat in our lives right now.
I really had a few breakdowns in female relationships in particular. So I have a friend that has been literally my closest friend for 20 plus years. We known each other longer than I've known my husband. And there was a few different relationships. Now pastoring is a whole different thing. [00:15:00] So when you pastor or you speak or you have, people are like, And they like come and try to hang out or not try to hang out with you.
You let them, that sounded really horrendous. Bring them into your world. And for me, I tend to go vulnerable too fast. And I started to notice what happened was, is I was letting people into my world and then the relationship would break down. The kicker for me was when my 20 plus year relationship with my best friend, like started to break apart and.
Wow. I am the common denominator in every relationship. That's falling apart around me, female relationship at that time. And I said, God, what healing do I need here? And what is interesting is he started to bring me back to. My relationship with my mother. So I know a lot of times we talk about, you know, the father wound or the father issues that we have.
But for me, it was the woman wound and that's literally the first chapter in the book. So if you're not in the mood to like go super deep right away and get healed before you can cultivate good relationships, don't find this book. [00:16:00] But I realized that. Some co-dependencies from my childhood in the brokenness that my mom and I had, and she readily lets me speak and write about this because our relationship is restored.
And from a time, from the time I was little, my mom would just, I was her emotional mother and she would tell me things that no child should ever know about her marriage, about her brokenness, about things she was walking through. And I carried them for her. Fast forward to being a pastor. Guess what I did for every woman or friend that came into my world, I just go in, I just went on ahead and grabbed their brokenness and carried it for them.
And then when I wasn't enough or wasn't good enough, the relationship would break down. And I was like, I was left there standing going, what did I do again? And so I realized I needed to have a lot healthier boundaries. So that, and that's not just about me. That's about them too going, you know, We say this in prayer ministry with people, you're their issues.
When you're forgiving someone, you have to say their issues are not my issues. They're not for me to fix and they're not for me to carry. And we [00:17:00] have to remember that in relationships, even in marriage with our children, it's like who we got to teach people to carry their own things to Christ. And I think that's what I was not very good at in specifically female relationships, but obviously it manifests in other areas of my life.
So really. That was kind of the progression 2018 coming up to now. And the book really started about a year ago. I started to write it about a year ago in the middle of the pandemic, still working through honestly relationships that were burning to the ground. But it was also a lot of, I don't know if you notice this, I'm sure you did, but I think my heart broke when I went, oh my gosh.
Over these last two years, we've really seen what our lives are built on. It's like the parable of. The house that's built upon the sand and house that's built upon the rock. When the storms have come, I have just seen like, wow, I don't know if their life or where is my life not built on the foundation of Christ.
And so started to just see those things. And it took me about [00:18:00] six months to write and then six more months until it was out and where we sit today. So, yeah.
Tony: It's interesting. One of the things that you talk about in the book is this idea of vulnerability and friendships. And I'm really curious about what's the tension between being vulnerable and being a boundary.
Andi: Yeah, no, I think that's really important. One of my friends, Irene Rollins said. Be authentic with many but only vulnerable with a few. And I think what we realize is even with Jesus, he's the perfect example of how to do relationship. And I think one of my favorite chapters in the book is actually where I break down how Jesus does relationship in the chapter about circles.
No, everyone can not and should not be your best friend, but Jesus had this. You the 12th and he had the 72 and the multitudes. And as I started to really look at how Jesus really only had three people that he brought close to him in the vulnerable spaces of his life, where he would let his guard down where he you know, sweat [00:19:00] blood in the garden of guests enemy, even though.
I slept and prayed. Did they sleep praying? They did sleep praying. But he still brought them close into the most vulnerable moment of his life. He brought them close where he really needed people to have enough faith to raise a little girl from the dead. He kicked to the rest of the disciples. And he brought his three in with him to raise gyrus his daughter from the dead, when he was on the temple Mount.
And it was revealed that he was the son of God and Moses and Elijah showed up. He only brought the three with him. So these very intimate spaces, Jesus only had three people with him. There was a vulnerability that he showed with those. Obviously his greatest vulnerability was when he would go. The father and holy spirit, but all that to say, you realize that then there was the 12 that he was on mission with and the 72 that he sent out.
And I think it's a beautiful model for us as a people to understand. We don't have to overdo it in the relationship friendship category, and vulnerability is not for everyone. We need to leave some things sacred. [00:20:00] Between us God, and maybe a small circle of friends or your spouse or whatever that is. But I think that these are the things we have to be aware of.
So be authentic with many but vulnerable with a few. Cause that's even what Jesus did.
Tony: Yeah, it seems like one of the major themes of this writing is this idea about self-awareness and authenticity. If someone is just starting out on this journey of, of self-awareness like, you know, w w what's the first step and, and realizing that maybe. I'm a little bit more of a train wreck than I thought, or, or like, Hey, I'm a little more open than I should be or, you know, whatever it is.
Right. I tend to be a little bit over the dramatic about these sorts of things, but yeah, what's the first step now.
Andi: I think that's really good. Yeah. Honestly, we actually have to give ourselves time for self reflection. So if you don't have a time, even if it's just once a week, you know, or, or, or once a month, if you're like I'm [00:21:00] too busy for that, start with, start with a certain amount of time where you can sit literally in the presence of God and go search my heart.
Oh God. I use someone. 5 million times in this book, mainly because it rocked my world when I first got saved and it still is the most tender, beautiful intimate picture of how deeply God knows us. But the very end when we understand how deeply he knows us, he's the one we go to to say, search my heart.
Oh God, test me and know my anxious thoughts. See if there's any way offensive in me and then lead me in the way of everlasting. If we're not in a place where we are not examining our heart before God, we will project on other people. We will expect other people to meet our needs, our unspoken expectations, our unmet needs.
We'll look to somebody else to do something literally only Jesus can. And I think one of the things, the reason why I talk about self-awareness and why it's important. Imagine, I didn't go back to move forward with my relationship with my mom. I just would've kept being a train wreck and every female relationship that I walked into [00:22:00] creating the same issues, walking through the same cycles.
So instead, what I did is we have to go back to move forward, not go back to camp there and not go back to, you know, set up a tent in the valley of the shadow of death, but to bring Jesus. Into those places of our past, where we're wounded and maybe believed a lie and then created a false belief system.
We actually have to go to that place to go, God, I believed a lie when I was wounded by my mother or that woman or that, or my father or this person not to blame them, but to grow up and get healed and ask Jesus, what is the truth about this situation so that I can create a true belief system and walk in that now.
So I think for me, Becoming self-aware means that we have to, maybe you're not one of those self-aware people and people keep saying the same thing to you over and over and over again. Maybe it will sin and go, huh? I think I might have an issue there. So I think though, yeah, but I think there's a reason [00:23:00] why we have to do that because we need to bring our whole selves to the table.
To be able to create any authentic connection, to be able to fill, fulfill the great commission together. We have to be able to be confident in who we are created to be so we can run together in unity, but in our differences.
Tony: And one of the interesting things, when I think about friendships today, and I have a, I have a teenager, a 15 year old young man who I'm trying to disciple. And then, and then even I just look at my own life. And one, one of the unique things is the impact of social media on our, on our friendships. Right?
As you were doing your research into this, like you know, I I'm, I'm self. Diagnosed FOMO. Like I hate to miss out on a party. I hate to miss out on things. Like I always want to be there and be present. How do we navigate the impact of a life that was probably not meant to be seen by the world that's now being seen by the world in in [00:24:00] today's relationships?
Andi: I think it's actually become really difficult. I think about when, when we first moved here almost 11 years. Instagram was just becoming a thing. And I'm kind of like, wow. Imagine if we didn't have that to compare ourselves amongst ourselves as the body of Christ Stephen. So that's just at a, you know a macro scale, but at a micro scale with us as individuals.
So for you, it's FOMO. For me, I think sometimes it's FOMO other times. I'm like, why aren't they commenting on my thing? I have this moment where I talk about how I once downloaded that unfollow me, who unfollowed me. Oh, my gosh. Have you ever done that idea ever?
Tony: There was a season.
Andi: I was like, why did I do this to myself?
But that created an unhealthy environment in my own mind. Cause I literally got on it and I was like like offended right away. I was like, how could they unfollow me? [00:25:00] Why did they unfollow me? I still see them on a daily basis. Like it was weird. And then I started to like, create like what I was going to say to them when I saw them.
But think about that. That is really genuinely creating an unhealthy environment in our hearts and minds. So we just have to be strategic with that. So what's so interesting is my 15 year old. And. My 14 year old, both sons. My 15 year old has decided to take all social media apps off of his phone. And my second son doesn't even have any, he's like an old man.
He's like, why would I want those things? So I just am like watching my children and learning from them. And I think we honestly just have to have boundaries with our phones and we really are bad at it. Like it's so. I do believe though it has created a culture that can be, that can breed drama. Cause I talk about breaking up with drama in one of the chapters in here.
And I do think that if we're not careful, instead of using just social media as a means, like it's just fun [00:26:00] or a means to an end if it's for your business, but be careful, like just, you got to protect your heart and your mind, like it's wild out there.
Tony: That might be. Segue into the, I wanted to ask you about betrayal. And you talk a little bit about betrayal and the book and, and, and so it, you know, it's, it's interesting. I, you know, you talk about betrayal as one of those things that we have to get, we have to understand and navigate it like Christ and knowing that it's definitely going to happen again.
W kind of give us an overview on how do we. Deal with such a painful feeling.
Andi: Yeah. Well, all of us face betrayal, and I think one of the things I had to come to grips with is that I haven't faced my last betrayal. And that was really difficult for me to really. Like swallow is that if I'm going to continue to put myself out there and be in relationships, there's going to be more of a trail.
There's going to be more pain. There's [00:27:00] going to be relationships that end in friendships that don't work out. So for me, I remember when I started to write this chapter. We had just walked through something very painful and as much as I wanted to write a list of all the people that had betrayed me and help people in this chapter to write a list of all the people that had hurt them and like burn it in the fire, like you're at summer camp and like forgive them.
Like that's not where God started. He's he started to unpack for me, king David. Which was very interesting. So king David, who was known as the man after God's own heart and Judas, who was invited to the table with Christ, who truly at the end of his life could have repented and been forgiven and welcomed back home, like w you know what I mean?
So I think the thing is, as he said, He was just starting to unpack for me, Andy, the things that David did, w w where some of the greatest betrayals, I mean, it was murder of one of his close friends because he slept with his friend's wife and had a baby, like [00:28:00] this is bad betrayal. And then you look at Judas.
Turn Jesus over to be crucified, the worst betrayal. And even Jesus felt that in Newington. So he said, what response will you have when I call your heart to the carpet? Not the person who betrayed you, because guess what, Andy, you've probably be in someone else's mind, whether you believe you have or not.
You've been a betrayer as well. And so what I do is I start with your own heart and I was like, even if this makes y'all mad, like we actually can't, this can not be a finger pointing. Let's cancel a whole bunch of people. Chapter it's about navigating it like Christ, letting people genuinely go forgiving them.
And then if you need to set up. Space between you and them to be wise, go ahead and do that. But you have to look at your own heart first. And so that's kind of where that chapter started is like navigating the trails, like navigating a ferocious storm. Even if you're a sailor, the storm is new. You've never sailed this storm before.
And so we just have to get good at [00:29:00] knowing that we've got to keep our heart tender no matter what.
Tony: Now one of the questions I wanted to ask. Is about the role of men and women's friendships. Right. And so I, in my wife and I will celebrate 19 years of marriage, high school sweethearts. She's my everything. Yeah. And I love her to death and I hear her. She's got different circles of friends with different closeness and, you know, she she's.
Friends that she's been friends with since like first grade. And oftentimes she processes different circles of friends with me and I, as her husband I don't really know what to do with all of that because it just feels so much more complicated than my friendships do. And, and I'm curious if you could talk to the guys for a second, how, how can we best serve our wives in the, the complicated friendships, [00:30:00] the appearance of complicated?
Maybe it's not complicated. I don't know, but like how can we best serve them?
Andi: No, I love that. I really appreciate that. I think my husband has been my greatest ally in getting into. In uncomplicating, my friendships, he has really helped me, but I think I'll speak to the men and women, women. Sometimes. It's good to let your husband who looks at things in a less complicated way.
Let him give you advice. Don't just like, cause I know we joke about how women are. Like, I just wanted to like verbally process with you. I don't want your like advice. Thing like communicate your expectations clearly to your husband first, because for me, I'm like, Hey, I want to process something with you so you can help me give me wisdom.
Cause I feel like I'm not seeing this clearly or say to your husband, Hey, I just want to process with you. I don't want you to talk to me. I don't want you to give me any advice, like all co co I'll come back later if I need it. But I would say to the husbands ask your wife also, if she's, if she doesn't know [00:31:00] what to do, or if she's not being clear with her expectations of you in that moment, ask her, Hey, do you need me to just listen right now?
Or would you like me to listen and see if there's anything that I can give you to help? Uncomplicate that situation you find yourself in? Because I think there had been moments for me where Ooh. I actually feel emotional where I felt like I just needed to like lay down and like, I was wrong. Like there was one situation where a friend just kept putting me in the corner and everything was my fault and I just kept taking it going.
You're right. I'm not doing anything right in my husband. That's not like, this is not true. You need to stop. This is unhealthy and this is not a safe friendship for you. And when he said that to me, I just sobbed and went, why am I, why do I allow myself to go into this place? And I want to say to husbands that are listening and, and even guy friends too, you watch another one.
Friends out there. You're like, you need to remind them of their value and their worth and [00:32:00] go. You do not need to enter into that complication. And it is okay for you to speak your expectations. It is okay for you to set a boundary. It is okay for you to let them carry their own issues. You don't need to carry them for them.
So I just, I would say to the. Let your husband be your ally in your relationships. Bring him in, ask him for advice and husbands ask if you can be like an ally. And can I come into this space with you and you know what friendships for guys really aren't as complicated. I've watched my husband where, you know, there's been a friend that he's had for years that the friendship grows apart and it has been painful for him.
But it doesn't last, as long as the pain lasts for me, he's like he processes it and then he's like done. I'm like, can you like pray for me for that? But I really, I really appreciate it. And it has been life. Okay. So helpful for me. So I don't know if that helps if that was.
Tony: Yeah, no, I, I th I think [00:33:00] that's, that's spot on.
I, we heard from a mentor of mine long time ago that you should create a code word around expectations when it comes to conversation. So whenever one of us gets into a place where we just. Verbally dump. We're both verbal processors. We love to say, well, I just need you to sit in the mud puddle with me.
Wow. And that image of, yeah, that image is just, Hey, I just sit in this mud puddle with me or, or, Hey, can I ask your thoughts on this versus, you know, I think. Clear expectations makes it a lot easier to serve each other.
Andi: Well, it really does. Isn't that wild? So my husband is the verbal processor and I'm the internal processor.
So he has to like, even for me, he has to go is now a good time. Like I need to talk. Cause I'm like, Yeah, we can do that. So.
Tony: My wife and I are both verbal processors, so sometimes we have to decide who's going to go first. Okay. You go first, you averse. And we, [00:34:00] we, well, we call each other on the phone probably four times.
Oh, she works in an office with, well, it says she works in an office. She works in an office pretty much by herself. And so she's like, and now I got some, I got words that it need to be said.
Andi: I need a person and I always want to be her person.
Tony: So that's good. It's good. It's good. One of the things that you're passionate about is being a spiritual midwife.
And I feel like that's a really interesting term. I'm wondering if you might define it for us and talk about what that looks like in everyday practice.
Andi: Yeah, absolutely. If you don't mind, I'm just gonna crack open my book. Because I think that it, do you mind if I actually read something really good?
Tony: Yeah, please do.
Andi: So, yeah, this is, and before I read it, let me just preface that the, if you look at the progression of the book, it starts with the woman wound. You start with dealing with your [00:35:00] own heart issues and ends on birthing the dreams of others and ends on being someone who is basically a disciple maker.
And. Someone who sees other people and is confident enough and who they are that they release other people into their calling too. So I just said this, the origin of the word midwife is mid, which means together with plus wife, women to become a spiritual midwife means that we are together with women.
Not against them. We are for women. They are not our competition. We are alongside other women to bring forth life, not. And I said friends, it is not our role on this earth to tear down, canceled, destroy, or slander another woman, or set her life on fire. So I think for me, what it truly is to birth another person's dreams to birth life is to come alongside another it's true discipleship.
It's true. It's that one-on-one, it's where you [00:36:00] get to a place in your life where it's not all about you anymore. And I think for us to do that is a true place of, we are surrendered. Our lives are laid down. We love who we are created to be in Christ. And we see another sister or friend that has something within them.
And I think a lot of times some of the best mentors that I've ever had. Or mentors that never had a mentor. And I know that sounds crazy, but I think about a woman named Maria Durso. I don't know if you've ever heard of her, but she, she's got a ridiculously amazing story, but her mother died when she was born and her father abandoned her.
And so she grew up with no one and got saved radically you know, in the hippie movement and never had a spiritual. Went through the eighties and the nineties with no women that wanted to invest into her. And that woman texts me almost well. I was going to say almost daily, but it truly is like, she's like the Lord spoke to me about you.
I have a word, like she's sending [00:37:00] me scripture. She's sending me prayers. She sent me she's deep in Queens. She's got the most amazing New York accent. And so she'll send me these things, but the truth is, is she has the saying where she's like, as long as they're a, somebody to. You are never out of a job.
And to get that from a woman who was abandoned and had no love, they've truly met Jesus and realize that their life is not just about. So becoming a spiritual midwife is honestly it's, it's the goal in life. Plus I love midwives and call the midwife is my favorite TV show. And if I wasn't leading in pastoring, I'd totally be a midwife.
So I'm all about it. So there's that too. Yeah.
Tony: Well, there's that, there's that there's that I love that. I love that. So I know that my listeners, they love. As they listen to this interview and they begin to think about this writing and resource what prayer should accompany kind of what your hope is that God will do with this.
Andi: What prayer [00:38:00] in, sorry, let me be specific what prayer, in what way? Yeah.
Tony: Yeah. And just as this book begins to flourish out in the world, as people pick it up, what's the prayer that goes with the reader, you know, how can we be praying for what this book is? Yes, yes, yes.
Andi: Gosh. Well, my prayer for the reader is that.
We will truly be healed and walk in wholeness body, mind, and spirit, and that we would become and make disciples that make disciples, that we would birth wife and that we would truly create godly community wherever we. And that it's up to us. Like we got to stop waiting for somebody else to do the work.
We've got to stop waiting for somebody else to invite us in some of you that are listening. You need to be the person that invites somebody else in, even if it's never been done for you before, because you just never know what's going to happen. So that's my prayer, my prayer for the [00:39:00] people, my prayer for them.
Tony: Yeah, I love that. I have one more question left, but I, before I do that, I want to ask, I know that my listeners are going to want to follow you all over the interwebs. What's the best place I know you've got a TV show, a podcast, where can we hook up with all the ministry that you're doing
Andi: all over the world?
All things that are, that are happening in my life on Andy, andrew.com. And you do spell my name, Andy a N D I. And Andrew, no S on the end, a N D R E w.com. And then all my social handles are just at Andy, Andrew, my name as well. So that's, that's easy enough, but also, yeah, the podcast is just called coffee with Andy and so is the TV show.
So it's kind of one in the same, they all weave together. So that's where you would find me on the interwebs.
Tony: Okay. Last question I love to ask people is an advice question, and you have to give yourself one piece of advice, except I get the name the exact day that you give the [00:40:00] advice. So, what I want to do is I want to take you back to your first day in New York city.
You just finished your first day. You've moved here. You're now a new Yorker. I think this would be somewhere in 2010. What's the one piece of advice that you're given to your younger version of yourself as you begin this journey?
Andi: Okay. I don't know why that is making me cry. If I could look myself in the eyes 11 years, I would say you can't please, everybody just be obedient to do this because man, I wasted a lot of days, months, maybe even up to a year or years of just trying to please.
The people, the Moses moments, you know, where Jethro comes in, I would have told myself, be wise, be a wise young woman, be obedient to Jesus. Listen, don't always listen to what everybody's saying. So, yeah, that's what I would say to myself. [00:41:00]
Tony: Amen. Amen. Pastor Randy, thank you so much for your time today, your generosity, your, your big old heart.
It was such a blessing to chat with you about this.
Andi: Thank you, Tony. It's so great to meet you and get to know you as well. You and I want to meet your cool wife, who I want to watch you verbally process.
Tony: I told you guys what a great conversation I love, the way that she talks about authentic and genuine connection about reconciliation, about how to look at friendships through a biblical practical insight. Do me a favor, follow Andy on the socials. Let her know that you heard you're on the podcast.
Give her a follow on Instagram. Her ministry in New York is so cool. I love following her and her husband who I'm also trying to get on the bike guests. So let them know that you appreciated her time today and don't forget, visit spirit and truth. [00:42:00] Sign up for our newsletter there. Our weekend review comes out every Friday.
We love to help you guys stay connected with all of the things happening. And one of the things you'll notice is the spirit and truth conference. That's right. The third week in March, the 17th to the 19th, the spirit and truth conference here, Dayton, Ohio, I'll be there. Matt Reynolds will be there. Maggie Omer, Rob Omer.
Mary Ann Hayes, so many incredible speakers, Kevin Watson, a lot, a lot of voices that will help you reclaim those practices of faith in life as always. I appreciate you subscribing leaving a rating or review on iTunes. I saw some new ones up recently, so thankful for that. And remember guys, if you want to follow Jesus, you must be willing to move.
